Miso 2nd time round? *warning, maybe TMI?
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Category: Support
Forum Name: Life After Miscarriage
Forum Description: Up to one in five pregnancies ends in miscarriage, yet for many the loss of a pregnancy is isolating and lonely. Share your thoughts and feelings here with others who have experienced loss.
URL: https://www.ohbaby.co.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=35506
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Topic: Miso 2nd time round? *warning, maybe TMI?
Posted By: spanky77
Subject: Miso 2nd time round? *warning, maybe TMI?
Date Posted: 30 August 2010 at 8:22pm
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OK, I'm kinda combining 2 threads here, cos I want my own!
So I caved. I had the misoprostol treatment today, it is was soo much easier than last time. So far. To refresh: MC#1 scan showed baby stopped developing 8w1d, found out at 13w2d, Miso treatment at 13w5d MC#2 scan showed baby stopped developing 6w3d, found out 9w5d, Miso at 10w4d Last time Miso took 4 hours before I felt anything and I was in lots of pain, and a weird zone. 1-2 hours of diarrhoea and light bleeding, really sore stomach/digestive cramping. Baby passed at 5pm, heavy bleeding, clots and squirtyblood every 20 mins for 5 hours, dizzy, weak, changing pads every 20 mins. This time Miso in at around midday, this started kicking in at 3.30pm, pretty much bleeding moderately. Had 45mg codeine at 4pm and some cramping for about 2-3 hours. This at its worst would have been 5 or 6/10. Certainly no worse than first days period cramps. Maybe 1 episode diarrhoea. Every hour or so, if I bear down, I pass large clots, but only if I try. I noticed the pills came out pretty much when i started bleeding, I don't know if that makes much difference? Pain now (8 hours after miso) is probably a 2. I'm not sure there's any codeine left in the system either, I feel pretty unopiated now. I guess I'm posting this wondering if other people have had miso twice and had quite different experiences? I'm not sure if gestational age makes THAT much of a difference? I know pregnancies grow fast, but there's only really about 10days difference between the gestational ages of these. Maybe the codeine did more than I'm crediting it for. Or maybe it isn't anywhere near over for me yet?! Also if anyone has had 2 mc on the trot (I have no children already, not that that changes how this feels?) how did they find the 2nd one? My first one (official pregnancy) completely blindsided me and I've taken months and months to even get to contemplating pregnancy again. This time, although I'm obviously sad and disappointed and having the feelings from last time, they feel much more dilute. I know this is different for everyone, but would be interested to know other peoples experience both of 2nd time miso and 2nd time emotional fallout |
Replies:
Posted By: jjands
Date Posted: 31 August 2010 at 7:30am
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Posted By: luvmylittlies
Date Posted: 31 August 2010 at 9:58am
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I don't have much to add but didn't want to read and run.
Mine were reasonably close together but for both of them I only found out at the 13 week scan that there were problems. I had the misoprostol and I got a bit crampy but nothing too awful each time but each time I was having it before a D&C. I did have an allergic skin reaction to it though the 2nd time. Emotionally; After the 2nd one I was fine for a couple of months, sad and terribly dissapointed but overall okay. But then I started really feeling the losses and it spiralled out of control for me. I've heard this from quite a few other people as well. So you might be fine, but I guess I'd just warn you that this could happen. ie you seem to be getting on with life and totally dealing with it then the sadness and grief about the losses turn up again and start to get worse. M/C is so sad and completely unfair. ------------- Adoring Mum to Talisin 8/9/11 and Kiara 18/01/10 |
Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 31 August 2010 at 6:10pm
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Thanks for responding, you 2.
I think I did speak too soon last night. . . I carried on passing large clots pretty much every time I got up and moved round. If I didn't move, not much happened. Got to about midnight and DP went to bed so figured I would. Took another 60mg codeine and hot milky drink and pretty much asleep straight away. Awake 4 hours later, uncomfortable. On loo passed another load of large clots and had completely flooded the 2 pads I put on to sleep in. Not only that, but it had gone through 2 layers of bathtowel and several layers of old sheet I'd put underneath me! I then started having horrific pain, every which way I lay didn't help. DP got me a hot water bottle (bless) and some cereal so I could take a voltaren and 2 paracetamol, and I eventually got back to sleep. That was the worst cramping I had from this lot of miso, probably 8.5 out of 10. Another load of clots when I got up, but pretty much mod-heavy bleeding today. feeling ok, not as woozy and out of it as I did last time round. No more pain. DEFINITELY a different experience from the 1st lot of miso. thesaff, you're right, mc is a big pile of bollox. Thats interesting what you put about the grief resurfacing after a few months, I'll look out for that. I keep thinking I know what to expect this time round, but things can always surprise you. The first mc was like that, the grief was quite drawn out and didn't really seem to be lifting till I got pregnant this time. Its been a very dark year, and I couldn't get my head round ttc properly for ages;the idea of starting back at square 1 kept me back (as did the medical recommendations NOT to ttc for at least 10 months - in the end we thought bollox to that). I'm considering going along to the local mc support meeting, not sure if it will be helpful or just upsetting. There's no way in hell I could have done it last time, but there's been a complete dearth of real-life people around me who have actually experienced what I'm going through. I'm open to ideas. Also considering ttc as soon as 1st cycle is over. I know last time I just wanted to be pregnant again but couldn't face it when it came to putting the wheels in motion, as it were. So I'm open to that not actually eventuating right away too. Its weird, things feel so normal right now, and I feel quite level headed and together . . . not upset at all (but then its easier when hiding out at home with just me and DP) |
Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 01 September 2010 at 8:05pm
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Hey spanky, I just wanted to say I'm so sorry to read your post. Don't really know what else to say but do be prepared for the emotional side of it to hit. How you're feeling right now (level headed and normal) was just how I felt before the storm really hit.
We're here if you need us  ------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 01 September 2010 at 10:33pm
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Hey Bobsta, thanks! I hope this isn't taken as offensive or the wrong way or anything, but I was remembering your thread and how everything kicked in a bit later, I remember you being "level-headed and normal" too!
Trying not to worry about the crash . . . I remember from last time, one day at a time . . . |
Posted By: mummyofprinces
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 1:25pm
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Hugs spanky... so sorry this has happened again!
I cant comment on miso as I opted for a D&C but I am really so very sorry! Will keep everything crossed that there is a healthy wee bean coming your way very soon! -------------   
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 6:13pm
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thanks Melnel.
Well update, not good news. Had betas done today and it seems my HcG has just halved, not dropped the 80% the hospital want it to have done. Which means I have retained product. I haven't bled enough, it seems. I haven't seen the gestational sac yet, and (I know this sounds gross) but I have looked for it. So it might still be in there. This afternoon I started bleeding heavier and bright red again (I was pretty much light to moderate flow since Monday) with horrendous uterus pain - couldn't sit, couldn't walk. It calmed down after panadol (easily placated, my bod) and is ok now, but the hospital want me to have another dose of Miso within 24 hours. oral as well, which is more likelihood of spewy and bumsquirty funfun. A bit gutted; DP is already behind on his work because he took Monday and Tuesday off to support me with the miso. He has a shoot on sat morning he has already rescheduled from a previous week I think, and he wanted to do a workshop which he says he doesn't HAVE to go to, but I feel like such a party pooper. I don't know whether to take it tomorrow night and just have a sleepless night (lets face it, I'll be feeling sh*te either way if it works or not). I've got a meeting tomorrow to get something signed off for school and don't think I can put this back any more. I just don't want to be on my own with the miso. The signs have pretty much all been there, I haven't crashed physically or emotionally since Monday yet I expected to. I feel pretty much the same: appetite/sleep/mood wise to before I took the miso. My temps are still high as they were last week. I've noticed all this but just hoped my bloods were in a better state than they were last time (anaemic) and thats why I was feeling ok. the weirdest woowoo thing is that last night I dreamt that I still had the baby growing inside me, and in the dream I was wondering how this could be so, after all the miso-bleeding. Woke up really sad, realising not pregnant after all. I seem to have these slightly spooky dreams the day before I find out these things (had one before the 1st Scan of Doom, and also the day I think official mc#1 happened - had my first 'labour' dream). I like to think my subconscious is trying to cushion the blow. Oh and I really don't want D+C as one of the scans suggested I might have one of them there Mullerian anatomy thingys, and (all the people in the hozzy I've mentioned this too seem in agreement) and there is much higher risk of complications following that procedure that, given my issues in carrying these pregnancies, I really don't want to add to them. Fx this 2nd dose does the trick |
Posted By: mum2ollie
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 6:18pm
| hugs your way spanky. Gosh it sounds so horrible! Can they do another scan and have a look to see how much is left in there. Surely after that much bleeding you would be well and truly cleaned out! FX this all works! |
Posted By: jjands
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 6:31pm
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Posted By: mummyofprinces
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 7:04pm
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Oh more hugs! hope the second dose works!!!!! -------------
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 7:18pm
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Aww thank you for posting and being supportive.
Apparently the hospital has revised their scanning protocol as too many women were being scanned with retained product (go figure). There was talk about me having a scan on Monday, but when I pressed to get this booked (played the ignorant 'is that something I do, or something you do' card) the lady got all vague and we would discuss that tomorrow. My gut feeling is that the baby is still in here. Seems a scan is now a privilege not a right, but my understanding also (from these forums) is that scans are only free for, what, 2 weeks after mc, and I certainly don't want to have to fund this privately because the hospital has skirted round it for 2weeks so they don't have to cover it? (Dear Health and Disability Commissioner . . . ). I'm not sure whose actually acting fast, I think the lady I'm dealing with is a nurse . . . never asked her job title. Maybe a CNS? She's not a doc, I know that. they have conveyed the idea that hcg testing is a more accurate indicator of effectiveness of treatment immediately post miso. I'm paraphrasing too. Yeah I think it will be tomorrow night . . . stocking up on more pads and chocolate. Mullerian (sounds like a kind of yoghurt!) anomalies are your septate, bicornate, heartshaped uteri. I think the risks are (correct me if I'm wrong) higher for scarring and adhesions (google Ashermans syndrome if you like medical stuff) due to the shape of the uterus not being 'standard issue' and it being a pretty much blind procedure. i've had about 7 scans in the last year, only one has hinted at this being a possibility (ie not confirmed) but I'm taking no chances, being the statistical anomaly I am! |
Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 02 September 2010 at 9:16pm
Oh crap spanky, you are having a rough time of it, and don't worry, I'm not at all offended, your comments made me smile! 
That's the great thing about this place, we can all share what we go through to feel better and it also helps the next person to realise they're not the only one. There's comfort in knowing that others have been through it. Sad it happens to so many though. I really hope the second round helps clear things out so it can be over for you. I can't imagine what it would be like as I had a D&C, you are one brave chickie. ------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: jjands
Date Posted: 03 September 2010 at 7:23am
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Posted By: Princess_Bubs
Date Posted: 03 September 2010 at 9:19am
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My heart goes out to you Spanky and I hope that you don't have to go through this physical pain much longer.
In relation to abnormalities of the uterus, I had a suspected Bicornuate/Septate uterus when I went for my D and C. I spoke to the surgeon about it and if there were any additional risks, and he told me that sometimes the procedure takes longer, but other than that there are no risks. I was under for about 40/45 mins when most people say it's only about 20 mins. I never asked why as I didn't want to know. However I had a very quick recovery (physically, anyway). I'm just saying this in case it does come down to a D and C but I hope that the miso works for you soon. Lots of love and strength coming your way  ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">  Two Precious Angel Babies 2010 / 2011 
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Posted By: babygiraffe
Date Posted: 03 September 2010 at 9:52am
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Massive hugs from me Spanky, I hope this gets sorted soon. Take care - lots of love
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 04 September 2010 at 12:53pm
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thanks everyone for your support
I guess I should rename this thread - its now 'miso third time round'. Well I took the cute little hexagonal pills last night, had a bit of cramping, nowt too major - no pain relief - I wanted to keep present and upright so they would work. But I don't think they did - a few small clots came out 5 hours after ingestion, nothing resembling sac though, and about an hour after the cramps started, they stopped just as quick. I don't feel any different to before taking them, no huge flow, BBT is back up again, so I'm not that hopeful. The lady at the clinic last week seemed to think that taking them a 3rd time isn't usually that effective (I guess if taking them twice before hasn't worked, whats the use in keeping on with them). My body just won't seem to let go, but I don't even really know whats left. I have a good idea though. So so worried about D+C now. |
Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 04 September 2010 at 7:29pm
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Oh spanky it sucks that the pills are doing what they need to do. I hope I can ease your mind if you do have a D&C by letting you know that my D&C was very quick, painless and had no lasting after affects or complications.
------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: monkeys
Date Posted: 04 September 2010 at 9:39pm
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Spanky I just wanted to try and reassure you as bobsta did about the D&C. I was PETRIFIED about the idea having one, and waited and waited for it to happen naturally but didn't. Eventually I decided the D&C was what I had to do.
The experience was fine, painless, and I can't say enough about the staff at Waikato hospital - they were amazing at putting my mind at rest. I was only under for 20 mins. my FX for you to have a positive outcome ------------- 3 little Angels July 10, May 11, Apr 13
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 05 September 2010 at 1:27pm
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Thank you for trying to reassure me! Although the idea of surgery leaves me cold, I would suck it up if it was necessary and go get it done.
the bit I'm concerned about is the aftereffects on my fertility, the fact its a blind procedure and no-one is definite on the structural anomaly I might have, or not. I just don't want to add to complications I already have. I know D+C's can still result in retained products. I think I feel a scan would be useful to locate what and where the 'products' are, and have a more intentional look at anatomy. I don't think D+C with camera is usually done, is it? I know the big-girl thing to do is wait and see what my bloods say tomorrow. I know I had some pain and cramping on Thursday afternoon so could potentially have passed more than I think. My gut says that I don't feel any different. I don't 'feel' empty. I don't feel more or less of anything to what I did two weeks ago. I also do wonder if my miso experience last year involved mildly haemorraging, ie not the norm, and that now I'm waiting for something that isn't what usually happens anyway. I need to stop thinking, I think! |
Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 07 September 2010 at 7:01pm
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OK my bloods yesterday showed the hcG had just about halved again, so still remaining tissue.
While in the shower last night I decided to check cervical position/opening etc (I don't regularly do this) and discovered some tissue half hanging out of my cervix - not easily removable. Phoned the Assessment Unit first thing this morning, went in about 10ish, the doc had a look but was unable to remove the tissue. I did not want her to continue at this point. I was still pretty against D+C especially without being scanned to see what was left. Begged to try the miso one last time (wasn't going to get scanned today as MRT's on strike) and stayed in the day unit . . . long story shortish, cervix open a bit about 4 hours after miso, 'products of conception' manually extracted although still a clot left, but I was ready for her to have taken the speculum out like 10 minutes ago, hopefully I can pass the last of this on the tail end of this miso (which hasn't really produced that much so far). Scan next week (hopefully they're not gonna charge me for this . . .) and fx this is it . . . |
Posted By: jjands
Date Posted: 07 September 2010 at 7:12pm
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Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 07 September 2010 at 9:21pm
Oh wow. At least most of it has passed now and hopefully the the miso gets the last remaining clot out. I hope your scan next weeks shows you are in the clear as you've already been through so much  ------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 16 September 2010 at 8:51am
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guess what, I still have placenta with active blood supply.
Woohoo. Am I still pregnant? My body still thinks so. Dunno how I can go through 3 miso treatments and STILL have half of it left in there. Sooooo over this . . . or not? |
Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 16 September 2010 at 7:33pm
OMG, are you okay? Well that's a dumb question. We're here for you spanky so talk if you need to. I hope your doctors have got a next step for you to sort things out. It's not fair you have to keep going through all this  ------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: mum2ollie
Date Posted: 16 September 2010 at 7:35pm
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Wow! What do they do now? Do you have to have a D&C? Oh Spanky this must be so horrible for you :( -------------   
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 16 September 2010 at 10:08pm
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I'm actually not too bad, remarkably well considering! Keeping busy and not keeping this stuff in my head is good though, have felt people being a lot more 'present' this time round (but I'm being more open and verbose about it all too)
Pretty frustrated too though . . . I can't really understand how its lasted through all this miso and additional cramping. Things seem to be slowing down bleeding-wise and no cramping or tenderness since last miso, but haven't had a hormone crash yet (so riding this as much as poss - went back to gym this week to try and address the deconditioning, but too woozy to do anything too hardout). My hcg's seem to be halving every 3 days, I'm now down to 290 or something. The sonographer did a 3D scan after all (yay for him!) but couldn't determine whether I had a wonky ute or not, so no clearer on the D+C (actually very clear, still trying to avoid, within reason). he told me I had 'textbook presentation of retained products' and something needed to be done. Roll forward one hour and I have a doctor telling me she thinks it might be a polyp. But that they don't need to operate, will take my hcgs then and next week and review next Wednesday. I think surgery is inevitable, I'm wondering if something can be done with hysteroscope. there's risk of scarring from D+C and there's risk of scarring from infected retained products, so don't know whats best. |
Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 17 September 2010 at 6:53pm
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Well considering your HCG is 290 surely there must have been some retained product? At least it reducing though, that's the main thing. It's good their doing scans and keeping an eye on things without you having to chase them. It's hard to know what the right decision is in a situation like that. I really hopes it all works out and you can avoid surgery. You are handling everything really well too! ------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 23 September 2010 at 5:40pm
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Yay, no surgery. Watching and waiting - weekly bt's till hcg hits the magic 0
Was 82 yesterday, and halves every 3 days, so in about 3 weeks I should be able to POAS for a BFN! Who would actually be looking forward to that? Taking double iron doses, on a steak and spinach diet (and failing miserably, I don't make a good daily carnivore), and a bit less dizzy (not that I should have been anyway, only the stores are low). Still bleeding, which is just annoying now. Still not sure how I'm feeling. Haven't been upset too much lately, when I have, its been around the prospect of surgery and risks, not miscarriage stuff. Feel like a bit of a fraud, in that I'm not that upset about loss (ok, if I sit and think about it, I can be). I didn't think about due date too much as in 'its gonna happen', this preg seemed very much 'see what happens, don't get too excited' The only thing I guess I felt sad about is that it was probably this week that we would have told everyone we were utd (playing it safe) Maybe I'm still in the 'numb' phase? |
Posted By: Bobsta
Date Posted: 23 September 2010 at 7:49pm
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It's great the HCG is coming down and yeah, it does seem a bit whacky looking forward to getting a BFN, lol.
I hope you don't get side swiped by the awful grief feelings. Don't worry you're not a fraud if you don't! I remember my numb stage and it was like I did everything on auto pilot. I had no emotion at all. I was like a zombie. You don't sound like that so fx you'll be okay. Sometimes I think about how far along I'd be right now but I don't get sad which is good, it just makes me even more focused on doing the right things to get UTD again as soon as possible so I can have my only lovely bundle of joy one day 
FX that won't be long for either of us. ------------- Me 34 Him 35 DD almost 2 years old and... Baby #2 on it's way! http://www.babygaga.com/" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: babygiraffe
Date Posted: 24 September 2010 at 9:17am
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Glad that the hcg is coming down Spanky. So pleased you dont have to have surgery as well. Three weeks will be up before you know, you can pee on the stick, get your BFN and then concentrate on your BFP
My grief didn't kick in til around 3 months after my D&C........I think its different for everyone. I had days of feeling great, weeks of feeling like sh*te. I didn't manage my grief very well though, if there is a next time (god forbid) I will know what to do to take care of myself better. Dreading October a little bit, thats the due date of my number 3 angel. Think I'll be ok though, feeling pretty good about life at the moment. Mabye I'll celebrate my angel's due date with a BFP 
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Posted By: spanky77
Date Posted: 14 October 2010 at 10:16pm
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Posting here for jjands, don;t want to be psychostalker but are you getting my PM's, I know I sent one or 2. No pressure to reply, just got a feeling and thought I'd ask here.
Well in other news I guess those 3 weeks are up? I think I'm going to try and do positive focus things in the Preggy Planning Forum and will try and keep the mc ranty stuff in this forum (although I know will cross over there too) Hcg was 3 this week so still not 'clear'. Seemingly gearing up for another af after one maybe 3 weeks ago - hello cramping and clots and bleeding harder again. Think the grief is starting to kick in too, I'm getting stupidly sad over my Gran having been dead for 15 years tomorrow (its not upset me for years). Its manageable, I'm much more ok with crying in front of people I don't know too well, but in certain environments of invisibility and indifference it doesn't help feeling all alone in this. I told myself I would treat myself to a fullbody massage when the bleeding stopped and my body hasn't even the decency to allow me this. Over six weeks of daily bleeding with only one day of no bleeding. 3 misoprostol sessions, two periods, one manual removal of material, endless cramping, not sure how many internal exams, one ultrasound, one garden burial, endless tears, ten(?) blood tests, over 100 sanitary pads, no BD (not risking infection and the constant bleedings a bit offputting and a constant reminder. Poor DP - watermelons for nuts) and STILL NOT RESOLVED. So hoping the hcg doesn't hang out at 2 or 3 for a couple of weeks |