Constructive Help and Wise Words Please
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Category: Have A Baby?
Forum Name: Toddler Times
Forum Description: Is bubs growing up and getting into everything? How do you train them to use the potty? When do you start feeding solids? Share your tips and advice here!
URL: https://www.ohbaby.co.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=17860
Printed Date: 22 July 2025 at 7:22pm
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Topic: Constructive Help and Wise Words Please
Posted By: FionaS
Subject: Constructive Help and Wise Words Please
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 1:43pm
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Right. So Elle is a pretty grumpy grump at the moment.
I am still convinced there is something underlying her tenseness / irritability but we are not going to find out what that is so I just need to deal with the behavioural side and I need some help!! We went to music this morning and Elle enjoyed dancing. However, I am a leader so I need to help with chores. After music Elle decided she wanted to leave so lost the plot. It's either her way or the screaming-way with her. I had to stay to vacuume so told her "Gabrielle I know you want to leave and you feel frustrated but Mummy just needs to help clean up and then we will go. You can stay with mummy and help or go and play with the toys. We will leave soon". So she proceeded to scream and scream and scream...I mean real full on, someone is torturing me scream. I usually just leave but I really wanted to do the vacuuming as it was my turn. By the time I was done, she was a mess...saturated with tears etc. And yet the moment we left, she was 100% fine, giggling, running away from me in the carpark etc. This type of thing happens many many times a day. I have read books, watched supernanny etc so have some ideas of what to do, the need for consistency etc but it is hard! How would you deal with this type of thing? ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Replies:
Posted By: katie1
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 1:48pm
| That is so hard Fiona. I honestly think that you handled it perfectly. I can't think of anything else - you gave her choices, explained her feelings to her and made things clear about what you were doing. You are doing a great job. She is lucky to have a Mummy like you. |
Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 1:55pm
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wise words i have none of ...
obviously she wanted you to leave and the fact you didnt cause she was screaming is good. the only other thing i do is if the behaviour continues then i tell toby (my screaming paddy thrower) that the behaviour is unacceptable and if we are home take him to his room and tell him if he wants to scream he can do it there. oh and i suppose making sure that while she was scraming you are ignoring her and carrying on as normal as possible... ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker"> 
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:06pm
The ignoring part is so hard when the small person is clawing at your legs!  ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:13pm
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ah, thats when you remove them and take them to a diff part of the room and tell her its not acceptable (or whatever word you choose) then go back to where you were and carry on and do that as many times as it takes.... ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker">
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Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:20pm
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Fiona you are a great mum and you're doing a fabulous job with Elle.
It seems she's now at an age where she's demonstrating her power over you. Toddlers are brilliant at giving you guilt trips. The important thing is not to give in, which is what you did this morning and that's excellent. The other equally important thing is not to give the behaviour any attention - none at all, not even angry words because in a toddlers mind negative attention is better than no attention at all. She's a smart girl and she'll quickly learn that there's no point playing up. If it's really getting too much for you, the noise and/or having her pulling on your legs find a safe room or blocked off area to put her in. Pick her up and carry her without cuddling or looking at her and put her down and leave her there while you continue what you have to do. If the hall where you're vacuuming is the only safe place remove yourself for a few minutes. It does seem awful and listening to them cry is heartbreaking but trust me, this method works on even the most stubborn child and soon all you need to do is threaten to remove them and they will stop. -------------  
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:25pm
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Another Q for the experts:
What about at dinner time. Last night all was well, I served dinner and we excitedly sat around the table for a family dinner. She took 1 look at her plate and started to scream. She wouldn't try it, she wanted to get down but when down wanted to be up etc. I tried to reason with her - that didn't work, tried to ignore, that didn't work etc. It went on and on. 30mins later she was still going and asking for rice (which means sweet creamed rice). As the entire tantrum was over her wanting rice, I didn't want to give in but didn't know what to do so once she was calm, got out the creamed rice and let her have it. Was that the wrong thing to do? i.e. did that give her the message that the tantrum was worth it?? ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:26pm
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Part: 2
For situations when you know you're going to be busy and suspect Elle might play up the best thing to do (easiest on both you and Elle) is to prevent the situation. When you're going to be busy after mainly music take an activity with you: a snack (or a sugarfree lollipop), some colouring in books and crayons, put a cd on so she can continue dancing (you could even get her a kiddi walkman). Is there anything that particularly works for keeping her occupied at church? Maybe you could try this too. -------------
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:29pm
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Mrs M - at church she was going very happily to creche which is a huge room (next to the one we use for mainly music) filled with toys etc. She would just jump down straight away, wave goodbye and run off to play. She was fab there for a couple of months but now is going through this new phase of being insecure again...
As an aside, she is seeing the chiropractor again tomorrow for the first time in 4 weeks (yahooo!) so I am sure that will help heaps. ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:36pm
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Part 3:
Alway remember you're doing a fabulous job as a mother, it's the toddlers that are feral! You are not alone!! Check out this thread from January (when Michaela was about Elles age) http://www.ohbaby.co.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13632&KW=The%5FStuarts - Link I recently read that the worst of the toddler trantrums start happening at about 18 mo as they realise their independence without understanding their boundaries. The same book also said that the tantrums start to ease off around 2 - 2.5 years old which certainly seems to have happened for us (she still has them but less frequent and not as bad). -------------
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Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:45pm
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Wow, I obviously type too slow.
Dinner time - you did what worked for you, and doing this sort of thing as a one-off isn't bad at all the important thing is to not let it become a habit. If she starts doing it every meal time then it's time to send her to bed without dinner (I'm not kidding, it does work but I'd only use it as a last resort). Creche - is it safe for her to go and play in the creche room when you have to clean up after mainly music? Do you do cleanup every week? Maybe part of the issue is the routine changed, she may have got upset because you normally leave straight away but didn't this time. -------------
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:53pm
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We alternate duties. 4 weeks leading music, 4 weeks on welcome/clean up, 4 weeks on morning tea. So far I have been less than helpful every week as Elle **needs** me to stay beside her, and do whatever she wants. She'll be fine until I do something else. It is like she wants my undivided attention ATM.
Daddy is very unpopular. Poor guy gets home and Elle says "no daddy, bye bye". It's all mummy, mummy, mummy ATM. Heaven forbid DH and I should have a hug...she hates that most of all!  ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:56pm
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I was like that with my mum at that age, apparently she couldn't even go to toilet without me screaming down the house.
Is there anyway you could involve her in whatever you are doing at mainly music. Get her to go and pick up the big bits of rubbish before you vacuum, or with morning tea get her to help unpack the bits and pieces etc. ------------- 
 
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Posted By: my4beauties
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:58pm
Oh hun, sorry to hear you're having a tough time with Elle at the moment. Just thought I'd comment on this...
I think that giving her the rice definitely in her mind she would've thought she'd won, and her having the tantrum was worth it. DH & I have a rule that the kids eat whatever is dished up on their plate. If they don't want to eat it all, but eat most, that's fine. But they get that meal and no other option. They'll always try to ask for icecream after they've had their meal, but know that they won't get any if they don't eat what we've dished up. Every child is different though, and I have to say that R & G are pretty good at meal times. Gia is a lot more fussy and more of a snacker, but I think that's the age as well. So you making that a rule with Elle, may be easier said than done. It's definitely HARD work standing your ground, and very tiring! I know this, but I'm determined not to let my kids rule the house. After a year or two sorting Rico out through his terrible 2's and 3's, he's now really good and i feel it's paid off being so stern with him. It does get easier if you stand your ground with her. Otherwise Elle will work out how far she can push you, and will keep doing it, knowing that you will give in at some point. If Gia is asking for something she's not allowed, i.e. a biscuit or muesli bar when dinner's not far off, and I say NO! sternly and that dinner's coming, she'll wait. If I say no, softly and nicely she keeps on asking. I may sound harsh saying NO sternly to her, but she then see's I'm serious on the matter and no room for budging. If she thinks there's room for me to give in, and keeps asking, I get down to her level, look in her eyes and say NO Gia, don't ask again you're NOT having it. Go and play with your dolly or read your book until dinner is ready. Sorry if I've babbled there. I hope you can get some wise words out of all that  . ------------- My babies: R (9),G (7), J (5) http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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FionaS wrote:Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 2:59pm
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Michaela used to get really upset when DH and I kissed or cuddled. She'd try and pry us apart. We started involving her in our cuddles and would both give her big kisses on her cheeks at the same time - she thought it was hilarious and now doesn't mind us cuddling but often comes over so she can join in too. -------------
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 3:08pm
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My concern re: dinner is that she is already awake for hours on end in the night and if she is hungry I fear she will be awake even longer. Perhaps I should've given yoghurt instead of rice.
Cute re: cuddles Mrs Mojo. We include Elle too but she just hits us until we stop cuddling. Jealous wee madam.------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: my4beauties
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 3:30pm
Yes, our older 2 get jealous when DH & I cuddle. Funny things aren't they! ------------- My babies: R (9),G (7), J (5) http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 5:31pm
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I'm taking Elle back to the doctor tomorrow as this is rediculous. The only time she is happy is if watching TV or at the park. The rest of the time she is crying about goodness only knows what. She is in her room screaming as we speak. I do not know what the problem is but she had been crying not wanting to be up or down or to play for 20mins and so I needed some time out.
Please tell me this will get better. I am at breaking point. ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: Paws
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:19pm
To be honest I think the situation you described in the first post you handled it fine, it sounds no different to the tantrums our miss has thrown when she can't do what she wants. That's when we employ time out. We even had to do time out in the Warehouse twice the other day to the amusement of everyone else
Perhaps she really is at the age where she is testing the boundaries like never before. As I say, we do often get similar behaviour from Maddie. It's not easy though, we're sometimes exhausted listening to her wobblies! ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Paws
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:20pm
I so agree with this!! Sometimes it can seem to go on forever but if you don't crack they will learn that when you say something you mean it. It does work and it does get easier. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Paws
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:23pm
We have the same rule in our house. The only exception is if we have offered something completely new. If she has tried a few mouthfuls and then rejects it, she can still have dessert, at least she has tried it. If she rejects something we know she likes then tough. And yes she has gone to bed hungry a few times! Might seem harsh but again, it works for us. And she tends not to hold out for long once she knows we mean business. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: pepsi
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:35pm
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Sounds like you are handling things so well in terms of being calm with her and trying to explain things. I guess just being consistant in terms of no means no when she wants something. I totally hear you about the worrying she won't eat enough dinner and will therefore wake up hungry though.
We have the same problem even now with Alyssa not being too keen on DH, and will tell him to "go away" when he gets home from work. She generally shuns him no matter what he does and runs to me. However, when I'm not around, she is perfectly happy to be with Daddy (although still won't cuddle him or anything like she does with me). Just out of curiosity (because I don't know what your current sutiation is), but do you spend all day with her or does she go to daycare or anything during the week, or have time away from you at any point?. I just wondered if she was like this with everyone she is with when you're not there? Probably around a year old or more Alyssa was very clingy and grizzly with me, but was a different child with my mum when I went back to work and wasn't around. |
Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:43pm
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Thanks Paws. The prob here is that most food never even reaches her mouth. She will not try.
Pepsi - she goes to my MILs twice a week. She is not as bad there but in saying that she has a huge yard to run in and MIL just follows her around doing what ever she wants. MIL doesn't do anything except play with Elle during their times together. She has just been crying all afternoon - no tears mind you. Just grabbing at my legs and crying. ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: Paws
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:47pm
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I'm wondering, could part of it be that Elle is bored? Maddie sometimes gets the same way on weekends away from day care especially if we don't have as much time to do what she wants and play with her as much as she wants.
Perhaps that is were a day or two at daycare like you were thinking of could be good. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 6:50pm
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Sometimes she may be bored but not all the time. She just doesn't want to do anything except watch tv
Even if daycare was something we wanted to do, there are massive waiting lists. ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 7:00pm
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Well, after several hours of refusing to play, bath, go to park...anything, she has gone to bed having eaten nothing but pear and 3 plain rice crackers all day. She has cried all afternoon asking for TV and biscuits but meany mum would've cave.
What is going on! ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: BuzzyBee
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 7:39pm
Well there is an upside - Elle has eaten more than Lucas today 
I can understand your troubles on the food front, except my boy doesn't just refuse ....he THROWS it everywhere. Good luck with Elle hun, hopefully Chiro will help her out somewhat. ------------- Single Mum to a darling wee boy of 3 years :) |
Posted By: Maya
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 7:40pm
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I have no idea, but good on you for not caving! It is sooo hard when they are carrying on bananas to just give in and give them whatever they want. Mine are OK during the day, it's nights that they play up and scream for hours on end and oh boy the temptation to feed them just to shut them up...
Good luck with the doc and the chiro tomorrow. Oh and we have the same dinner rule as a few others have said: eat what's on your plate or go hungry. It's hard when they eat very little and then you worry about them being hungry later on but they soon figure it out. -------------  Maya Grace (28/02/03)
 (02/01/06)
The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
Lil miss:Chiara Louise Chloe (09/07/08)
Her ladyship:Rosalia Sophie Anais (18/06/12)
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 7:45pm
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Well she ended up getting up again and I gave her milk and a yoghurt (she hadn't asked for either so it didn't feel like I was caving). She has been soooooooooo beside herself that DH and I thought we should give her the benefit of the doubt in case she is sick (no signs of sickness other than misery). ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: 11111
Date Posted: 03 June 2008 at 9:34pm
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hey big hug's chick I sent you a PM, but jsut wanted to post in here as well you are an amazing Mum doing an awsome job. Big hug's I really hope you get some much needed answer's real soon. ------------- Deborah Mum to:   
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Posted By: Jay_R
Date Posted: 05 June 2008 at 1:30pm
| How'd it go at the dr Fiona? |
Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 05 June 2008 at 2:38pm
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The chiro was a big help and we are continuing with the treatments. Some people are cynical but it is just like seeing a physio - it takes time for the body to sort itself out. Sometimes you get worse before you get better too - that is true of many medical treatments.
He found sensory processing issues which I have suspected the whole time. My GP also believes she has sensory processing issues and will eventally fall somewhere on the spectrum but we don't yet know if it'll just mean she is a bit quirky or if she will need more help. Only time will tell. In the mean time, we will stick with the chiro, start omega's and I'll continue with the "sensory diet" work I have been doing to strengthen her sensory processing abilities. My GP said that chiro/biofeedback is being shown in clinical studies to be effective in helping with spectrum disorders such as sensory processing, ADHD etc so she recommends we keep it up. Elle is a sweet and intelligent girl who has always been oversensitive to the world around her. I am hoping with time and dedication she will learn to overcome the things that overwhelm her. Afterall, parenting is just a journey of equipping our kids with the skills they need to be the best they can be. Just as everyone is different, every kid needs help in different areas. Elle is highly sensitive and that is something that is hard for her now but as she grows it will be a tremendous asset if it is channelled contructively. Therein lies the challenge for DH and I. At the moment it is really hard as she is still young so can't fully express herself but as we grow as a family I suspect it will get easier. It's been tough and I'll admit it's been taking every ounce of energy but I know we will get there. It's been heartbreaking for me to see my wee girl struggling so much but I know it will get better. ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 05 June 2008 at 3:08pm
That is so true. All children are challenging in one way or another at some point in their lives and learning to overcome the challenges and work within our childrens limitations while encouraging them to step outside of their comfort zones is exciting, challenging, gruelling, upsetting, wonderful and helps us grow as people and as parents. I think the dedication you and your DH have to make sure Elle is the best she can be is commendable and will make you stronger and closer as a family. -------------
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Posted By: 11111
Date Posted: 05 June 2008 at 6:51pm
well said it sound's like you guy's have turned a couner and can see a bigger picture. remember we are all here if you ever nedd to vent or share. You guy's are great parents and going to be an awsome family. ------------- Deborah Mum to:
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Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 07 June 2008 at 2:08pm
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I'm pleased to report that my happy girl is back since her last appt with the chiro :) I won't go into all the technical details of why and how but suffice to say she is back to being super happy. Yipee! ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: james
Date Posted: 07 June 2008 at 2:23pm
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yaya for a happy wee girl i must say your a great mum james has senory issures himself so i know how hard big big hugs hun i just get over what a caring and loving mum and dad your wee girl has ------------- <a href="http://lilypie.com"><img src="http://b4.lilypie.com/nLJ5p13.png" alt="Lilypie 4th Birthday Ticker" border="0" /></a> |
Posted By: james
Date Posted: 07 June 2008 at 2:27pm
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and just too add with sensory issure childern are differnt to othuer childern they dont do it to be naughty or because they can and has mums we have to be sentive to this correct me if i,m wrong fiona ------------- <a href="http://lilypie.com"><img src="http://b4.lilypie.com/nLJ5p13.png" alt="Lilypie 4th Birthday Ticker" border="0" /></a> |